Any adults left in Washington?

[pgh69]

[quote=DonH;1227613]

Originally Posted by pgh69

What was the "serious change" that you were expecting from the Romney administration? Examination of our federal budget and an earnest attempt at entitlement reform..

Do you think that Romney would have made an "earnest attempt at entitlement reform?" If you do believe that, why? He refused to provide any specifics as to what he would have cut. I believe this is b/c he wanted to get elected and the people of this country like "entitlements" like social security, medicare, etc. Had he been elected, he would have wanted to get reelected. If he had supported cuts for those types of "entitlements" I believe he would have a one term President.

Incidentally, I am all for reforming SS and medicare. I'm all for raising the retirement age. I like the idea of treating people differently depending on what type of work they've done during their life. (ie., those who work in physically demanding, heavy labor professions should be permitted to collect SS at an earlier age than someone, such as I, who sits behind a desk.) I'm for reforming pay-outs for people, such as I, who are under 50 as of today. But, I'm also not running for office. Do you have anything more than "gut feeling" that tells you that Romney would have supported those types of reforms?

And, if you're in favor of reducing federal spending, how do you feel about making significant cuts to defense spending?

[quote=DonH;1227613]

Originally Posted by pgh69

What are the similarities between the US and the EU as you see it? Any significant differences? ? Not an expert on European economy but I have seen and read enough to appreciate the fact that entitlement’s are in need of serious reform and the beneficiaries of same are deeply entrenched.

I didn't expect that you were an expert on the European economy, but you are the one who said "I keep an eye on Europe to see where we are heading." If you do, then I would think that you believe there is some similarity between the two. When I ask you to identify a similarity I get Rush Limbaugh talking point on "deeply entrenched entitlement beneficiaries."

Here, some good, basic info on the EU's crisis....
http://useconomy.about.com/od/Europe...one-Crisis.htm

I see very little similarity between the problems in the EU and the problems in the USA.

[madmax]

Originally Posted by hrdguera

That is the beginning of the end when success is considered something bad.

This is another one of those myths successfully pushed by right wing media.
Please explain how "success is considered something bad".

If you are simply basing this on returning tax levels to the late 1990s, then that doesn't fly. Successful people were doing well then too.

[madmax]

Originally Posted by hrdguera

It is not a myth when people are despised and dismissed because they are either rich or successful.

http://www.spiritofspider.com/2012/0...than-the-poor/

http://www.randygage.com/blog/evil-m...g-rich-people/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...4203657AAdOMRg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vd1FOpB2WiI

http://wonkette.com/464994/science-p...generally-evil

Read some the comments on the posts and you will know what I'm talking about. Don't you remember reading the headlines and comments concerning Romney's wealth and his tax returns; even on the Backpages? If I have to explain it you; you are just being dense on purpose. Even the mentality of "Tax them until they bleed" is indicative of the current sub-mentality.

Ah, but you just confirmed the myth. It isn't the rich or successful that are despised, it's those that skirt the rules or try to set up the rules to favor themselves.

The varied list of "most admired" or "most respected" proves that to be false, especially when Warren Buffett and Oprah Winfrey are in the top 5.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...source=twitter

Romney's wealth was never the issue, his tax returns WERE for the reason I listed above. He was hiding something, most likely it would confirm the fact that he got to play by different rules than the average Joe.

Ross Perot was never lambasted for being rich... or Bill Gates... or Steve Jobs. It was never about how successful or rich you are. It was about your methods. There is a big difference between Warren Buffett and Bernie Madoff.
To quote you: "If I have to explain it you; you are just being dense on purpose." Nice...

And the "tax them until they bleed" thing is hilarious! And it's another myth.
Once again, we are talking about raising the top marginal limit a few percent, back to where it was in the late 1990s, which was way down from just a few decades before. It is silly to call this "tax them until they bleed" when you look at the history of top marginal rates.


When you look at the chart we are only talking about nudging back up to where we were during our most prosperous times... and still WAY down from a historical perspective. We have obviously overshot on cutting taxes. The Bush tax cuts and the resulting deficits prove that.

[pladecalvo]

Jeez man! Just why are Americans so terrified of anything that smells of socialism?

[madmax]

Originally Posted by pladecalvo

Jeez man! Just why are Americans so terrified of anything that smells of socialism?

It's been programmed into them for a few generations. They don't realize that the first "socialist" American institution was the Continental Army, led by the infamous socialist George Washington.

[evileye]

Originally Posted by madmax

It's been programmed into them for a few generations. They don't realize that the first "socialist" American institution was the Continental Army, led by the infamous socialist George Washington.

Please tell me why you say George Washington was a socalist? I have not heard that take on him before.

[dumbass]

Originally Posted by pladecalvo

Jeez man! Just why are Americans so terrified of anything that smells of socialism?

How's that shit working out for Spain?? or Greece?? or the responsible members of the EU, such as Germany, that are bailing out irresponsible members because of their socialistic stupidity??

What happened to the socialistic economy of East Germany?

Also pay close attention to France in the near future as they go down that slippery slope of socialism.

The unanswered question remains; "Who's going to pull the wagon when everybody wants to ride?"

[hrdguera]

Originally Posted by dumbass

How's that shit working out for Spain?? or Greece?? or the responsible members of the EU, such as Germany, that are bailing out irresponsible members because of their socialistic stupidity??

What happened to the socialistic economy of East Germany?

Also pay close attention to France in the near future as they go down that slippery slope of socialism.

The unanswered question remains; "Who's going to pull the wagon when everybody wants to ride?"

Ha, that's great DA. Sometimes these guys really crack me up! "What's wrong with a little socialism?" "George Washington was a socialist!" Then they want us to tell them something!
I'm going to work. I haven't time for such foolishness. In fact I'm finding less and less time or desire to deal with some of this stuff.
It is like trying to convince an Obama acolyte what is wrong with:

1. Obama's take on the Fiscal Cliff negotiations.
2. A $4 million Hawaiian vacation when the country is going over that aforementioned fiscal cliff.
3. A continually campaigning President pretending that the country's financial problems are someone else's job to lead and fix.
4. The idea that promoting class warfare isn't good for the country.
5. That there is a hing as voter fraud.
6. That raising the taxes on 1% of working Americans isn't going to solve the country's debt crisis.

And the biggest single lie that Obama acolytes don't want to face:
8. That the biggest problem standing in the way of solving the debt crisis is continued unbridled spending by Democrats in their "so far" successful attempts to keep buying votes from the coalitions of the entitlement classes.

It is definitely time to get off this train.

[madmax]

Originally Posted by dumbass

How's that shit working out for Spain?? or Greece?? or the responsible members of the EU, such as Germany, that are bailing out irresponsible members because of their socialistic stupidity??

What happened to the socialistic economy of East Germany?

Also pay close attention to France in the near future as they go down that slippery slope of socialism.

The unanswered question remains; "Who's going to pull the wagon when everybody wants to ride?"

The problems in Greece have to do with spending vs income, not "socialism".
Your trucking company operates on socialist roads. You are protected by socialist police and fire departments. Our country is protected by a socialist military.

The United States has always had socialist institutions, from day one. I think we can all agree that capitalism is the driving economic engine of the USA, but certain socialistic elements have been part of the reason for our success.

Purest ideologies rarely succeed. This is where is see where both you and Plad are coming from. Plad sees the fear that some Americans have of anything with a socialist slant as silly and naive. You seem to fear that socialism will be the downfall of the USA.
The USA will never be socialist - it will always be a balance mainly driven by controlled capitalism. The debate over the "fiscal cliff" is shining a light on that balance. The result of this debate will, IMO, reinforce a balance of ideologies.

[NOLA]

Originally Posted by dumbass

How's that shit working out for Spain?? or Greece?? or the responsible members of the EU, such as Germany, that are bailing out irresponsible members because of their socialistic stupidity??

What happened to the socialistic economy of East Germany?

Also pay close attention to France in the near future as they go down that slippery slope of socialism.

The unanswered question remains; "Who's going to pull the wagon when everybody wants to ride?"

You believe "everybody wants to ride" I believe everybody wants a wagon to pull.